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Tony McManus
As you know, we've been doing a series of interviews or specials, if you like, in the overnight programme featuring some of the great businesses which you and I would know and love over many, many decades. Some of the great family businesses in Australia go back over 100 years. Family Business Association, formerly known as Family Business Australia, changed the name because it broadened its horizon, if you like, and took in some of the great businesses in New Zealand as well. Affectionately known as FBA, we spoke to the CEO of Family Business Association a couple of weeks ago, Catherine, and said, look, one of the first people you've gotta talk to is Michael Stillwell. My reaction was surely not, not one of the great family businesses associated with Bibs Stillwell and Catherine said that's the one. So it is with great delight that we welcome one of the family members from the Stillwell group. Michael Stillwell, good morning to you, Michael.
Michael Stillwell
Tony, good morning to you. It's a delight to be here and hopefully you're going to introduce the other gentlemens and the others on the other side.
Tony McManus
Well, we will, we should too, because also had a great association with your father and the brand for many, many years here at 3AW. He is our great friend David G. Mann. David, Nice to see you.
David Mann
Good to see you. Good morning to you, Tony. Good morning.
So, good morning, Tony, and good morning, Michael. And it's a pleasure to be the surprise guest seeing you're talking about the great Stillwell family.
Tony McManus
Well, I tell you why it happened. Because Michael and I had a conversation a week or so ago, and he mentioned your name and I was reminded of the great association, David Mann that you had with Stillwell for many decades here at 3AW.
David Mann
Yes, the great Bib Stillwell. I look to the sky now. He was one of my mentors besides obviously my dear father. But I had 5 key people in my life who were mentors who advised me with various things, and I met Bib through a professional relationship by being the production manager at 3AW in Latrobe St, 382 Latrobe Street, and he would come in and we'd record commercials for his various dealerships. And then I met Michael and Robert and the rest of the family, Nick and Marianne and Gillian, Bib’s wife.
And we spoke, and then we became friends, and we speak about social things. I'd bounce things off him, and he was one of the people who, that's a great line. He always said David, I want you on some trusts, some boards or foundations in an honorary sense. It'll increase your network. It will help you live a better life and I'll be a part of that by making it happen. I went oh, and in those days, I really didn't know what trust boards or foundations were about. But one of them is, I became the chairman of Rural District Nursing Service, which was a business that was in the hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars. It wasn't, you know, your little business, and that was because of Bib. I was a board member and then became the chairman. But you know, you asked me with that as we speak about the Stillwell family, I'll drop in some stories about the great Bib Stillwell.
Tony McManus
There are many to tell. Michael, first up, welcome again to this very important little segment. Your recollection of father and those early days of the business, but even further back than that to some degree, as an outstanding Australian family business goes back to the grandfather?
Michael Stillwell
It does. My grandfather was in the grocery manufacturing and importing business and for some of the listeners, they might recall products like Turban Coffee Essences. So I'm going back before we had instant coffee, so pre and post war, coffee came as an essence in a bottle, and the byline was it's most disturbing if there ain't no turban. So that was my grandfather's thing. But he helped Dad get into the car business. We had an association with Lord Nuffield, who was a British industrialist who, and amongst other things, owned the Morris Car Company and MG, which was a sports car, stood for Morris Garages and Dad was given a an MGTC for his 18th birthday back in 1945, 46. Grandfather was able to procure one so that started a very significant career, not just in motorsport but opening a small workshop in Kew in a building my grandfather owned, servicing initially MGs and then as a sub-agent for lanes selling Morris Minors and Wolseleys and cars like that. So I can remember as a small child going to that place in Cotham Road and you know MGs and Moris Minors and all those wonderful British products there.
Tony McManus
And presumably, Michael, this was a time prior to the great brands that we knew and loved in Australia, like Ford and Holden being so more readily available later.
Michael Stillwell
The Holden story is interesting because Holden were getting hit in their strides in the early 1950s, and I'm gonna struggle to remember the gentlemen's name there, but he was the national sales manager for Holden at the time. And they were looking to grow their dealer network and thought that perhaps high profile racing drivers would be the right way to do that, so that was how Dad, Bibs Stilwell, got his reg hunt, you'd recall Bill Patterson, out of Ringwood. Reg Smith, who was Gary and Warren Smith's father at Oakleigh there, and then there were others interstate as well. So that got us into the Holden business in the sort of early mid 1950s.
Tony McManus
Those great families, whilst they were competitors, were they friendly business relationships?
Michael Stillwell
Very much so yeah. I can remember growing up where we lived in Burke Road in East Kew, just up past the old Dickies junction there, and you know, we would often, dad and mum would often have dinner parties at home and the likes of the Bill Pattersons and Reg Hunts and those would be very much guests at home, along with other sort of notable Melbourne car dealers that were growing their businesses at the same time.
Tony McManus
Am I right in saying that Reg Hunt then lived overseas for a lot of his later years?
Michael Stillwell
Correct. Yes. In fact, I think he lived in Monte Carlo.
Tony McManus
Yes, somewhere rather exotic, as I recall.
Michael Stillwell
I went to Regis’ funeral. It must have been about, when did he die? 3-4 years ago? I guess it was well into his 90s.
Tony McManus
Great times. What came first - the mechanical side of the business or the sales side of the business?
Michael Stillwell
Mechanical side initially. So initially it started as a Stillwell and George, so Derry George was an ex-Air Force engineer that dad knew quite well, and they set up this little workshop. But I think Dad saw some growth opportunities, and Derry was very focused on the technical side, and they split up and went their separate ways, and Dad just continued to build the business from there.
Tony McManus
And the racing side came in. Did father have an early interest in racing as well or did that come later?
Michael Stillwell
So we've got photos of the MGTC being run up the hill climbs at Templestowe and Christmas Hills, and all of the others. He went from the MGTC, an Austin-Healey 100-4, then I think the D type turned up. I can remember being driven to school in that as a very small boy, very exciting. Then a 250F Maserati Grand Prix car. So Dad took part in the early Grand Prix at Albert Park back around ’55, 56.
David Mann
No, Tony just pointed to me. And you said to interject it and tell some Bib Stillwell stories. We had a thing called the AM Club at Hilton On The Park. It was a business club and 3 or 400 people would turn up for breakfast once a month and we always had guest speakers. And so, as we were associated as the official station with the Australian Grand Prix Corporation for the Formula One Grand Prix at Albert Park, we decided we'd have a Formula One breakfast and Mr. Walker AC, the late Ron Walker organised Mark Webber, who in those days was the driver and straight Australian, and then we had the gentleman who was the marshall for the Grand Prix and then we had two legends, one called Bib Stillwell. Bib was not his name by the way, that's another story. Bibs Stillwell and Bob Jane. And so, they were there and I was there seeing it and just asking the questions. And it was all going along really well. And then I'll have to be very careful how I say this. And in the middle of it, Bob said, hey Bib, let's just tell the truth. This has all been a bit sort of, flimsy and then he said, in the days when you and I were racing, they had hay bales, they didn't have fences, they didn't have guard rails. Hay bales and the helmets we wore, if you stood on that crack and it was the funniest thing. And Bob was, I love Bob Jane, and he used some expletives and away it went. And the place just erupted. And I looked at Bib because Bib was pretty conservative. In fact, I don't think, now, I never heard your father swear.
Michael Stillwell
No, I never heard him use the F word.
David Mann
No, and so they went for it in this very prim and proper forum. And it was all about them racing. But when people calmed down from laughing, they learnt what it was like to be in high powered motor vehicles with very little protection. None of the luxuries we have today. And Bib and Bob were very, very good mates because in the end, you asked me to be very honest, Bob Jane was a bit of a rough diamond and somebody I thought the world of. But in the end, he did something that I hadn't seen him do before. And when we're sitting at the table, he got up and he gave Bib a big hug and said, love you, mate. And then went out.
Tony McManus
Great relationship. Our very special guest in the studio, we've got two really, David G Mann for a long time, here at 3AW as you know, and Michael Stillwell. Talking about those very early days with brands like MG and Wolseley, I'm sure there will be people that actually probably dealt with a member of the Stillwell family right through those years here in Melbourne. We'd love to get some calls around that. We're doing this series of little spots every couple of weeks talking about Family Business Association, special guest in the studio is Michael Stillwell, one of the family members. From where did the name Bibb originate before we move on Michael?
Michael Stillwell
That's an interesting story. So, my grandfather's name was Bert and my grandmother's name was Marion. So, they took the Ber from Bert and the Mar from Marion and created Berma. Now, and that was what he was christened as. Now, we'll talk about the aviation in a little while, but when Dad worked in the US, Berma Sellers Stillwell was just wonderful. That's what he was known as. But as a small boy, he couldn't say Berma, so he called himself Bib or Bibby, and it stuck. So, in Australia, he was always Bib Stillwell. But interestingly, overseas, Berma.
Tony McManus
More in just a moment. Let's take a couple of calls. David, Taylors Lakes. Good morning, David. Say hello to Michael Stillwell and David Mann.
Caller - David
Hello Michael and David. Michael, I don't know if you'd remember me, but my first job in Melbourne when I moved down from the country about 50 years ago, was working in your pre-delivery department.
Michael Stillwell
With Bill Kelly, he was the manager.
Caller - David
Yes, that's right and Bernie was also in pre-delivery. And I used to come in and have chats to you in the office. When we used to supply the marshall cars at Calder, I used to have the honour of taking one of those home for the weekend and taking that out to Calder. As a 19, 20 year old young fellow, it was a pretty big thrill.
Michael Stillwell
And marshalling at Calder is pretty special as well. In fact, recently, they've just taken circuit racing back to Calder and we had our first race spending there, I think in October last year. But James have reopened it which is great.
Tony McManus
David, for how long were you part of the family business?
Caller - David
About 18 months. And then I've moved on to another job, sort of foolishly, but probably one of the best jobs that I've had and enjoyed it.
Michael Stillwell
I love hearing that and that so many people, the feedback we get, love working for Stillwell. You know, one of our former South Yarra employees who's been at another dealership and brand in Melbourne for a number of years, has just rejoined our organisation and I'll send you a little note on LinkedIn. I said, Dad always said they always come home eventually.
Tony McManus
That's a lovely touch. So, the combination of the business and the racing, do you remember as a child and how that interest in racing was generated in your head?
Michael Stillwell
You've lived it, breathed it, ate it. Interestingly, Dad and Lex Davison, who's another famous Australian race driver who sadly passed away in the mid 1960s as a result of a race car accident at Sandown. But Dad and Lex raced at Vermont in the early 1960s, and dad remarried and the lady he married, Gillian, who was my stepmother and the mother of my younger brother and sister Nicholas and Marianne, was the race secretary for John Wire Automotive, which was the team that ran the Aston Martin at Datalex Drove. That was how they met. But yeah, it's in the blood. And it continues in the generation we've got. Our kids are all involved and they love it.
Tony McManus
There were great names growing up and I've spoken on the programme before, sitting in Lightwood Rd, watching the development of Sandown as a kid, three or four, on top of the post office there and the great names that still resonate at that time. Early part of the 60s, one would be Norm Beechey, I'm not too sure why, certainly Bob, and of course Dad Bib. Around that time.
Michael Stillwell
That’s right. And Jack Brabham, when they used to come back for the Tasman series. We were talking earlier about entertaining at home, and I can remember in the 19, sort of mid, late 1960s, we were entertaining at home, the likes of Jackie Stewart, Jim Clark before he passed away, Graham Hill. Again, amazing. You asked the interest in racing, growing up as a teenager in that environment is very, very special.
Tony McManus
Yeah, I'll bet. And surrounded by some of those great names, David.
David Mann
Well, another Bibs Stillwell story. Because when I've started voicing the ads, not just recording them, I would actually then drive the cars, which was, you know, pretty good. We would ring up and say right, come over to Williams Road, South Yarra and we'll give you a car. And anyway, in those days, it was the Metropolitan Fire Brigade and I was on call all the time for what we call further assistance. In these days, it's Fire Rescue Victoria, still doing the same job on call. Bib said what happens? He's very intense. What happens? I said, the pager will go off, and it will say where the fire is, and then I'll speak to the communications people, and someone proceeding. So you're in our car? And I said yes, I'm in your car but I'll get it somewhere safe. He said, what I'll do, come out, I'll get a special car for you. I said, what do you mean? He said come on out and I'll see you. And he said Robert was looking after Stillwell BMW. So I went there, and Bib was so frustrated because I know nothing about cars. I know where the petrol goes and that's it. He said, David, I've got you a 5 series Red BMW with all the extras. He said because it's red, it goes faster and it looks really good and it's a beautiful motor car. So I said Bib, okay.
So about two nights later, we got a big factory fire, so I roll up in all the Metropolitan Fire Brigade gear, get out of this red BMW, and the first thing is the police officer because I had to show the ID to get though. Mate, you're from the MFB? I said yes, sir. And he said so I'm here to look after the media and communications. He goes, what's the go with the car? I said, don't you know that all officers in the MFB have red BMWs and he just looked, he went what? And I just proceeded on. By the time I got back, Victoria Police have got all the D-24, what's this about everybody gets a red BMW? But Bib had a smile with that, he loved that story. He said, but I'm putting you in a Taurus. I said, I beg your pardon? He said, I'm putting you in a Taurus. In a couple of weeks, he bought Knox Ford and Taurus was a car that was a big car. It was very comfortable, but it just didn't work.
Tony McManus
And fully imported as I recall, Michael.
Michael Stillwell
It was. It was an American built car. It was the forerunner to warm us up for the AU Falcon and I think those that know product pretty well would be aware that the Taurus was not exactly a success and the AU had a whale teeth grill on it. And it was very quickly replaced by, I think the BA from memory.
David Mann
The sad news was I moved from the Taurus because it wasn't really happening. Back into a BMW. And this is fact, that 3AW was the official station for the Australian Grand Prix Corporation, the very first Grand Prix. The late Ron Walker was the chairman, Judith Griggs was the chief executive and we're at 43 Bank Street and I had a privilege of a car park right at the front of the building so I parked my car there. And in those days, there were a lot of protests about you're going to take over Albert Park, and it's gonna ruin the place and everybody's got a right to protest. But what they did, some of these individuals that were, I think eventually brought before the courts, they decided they would key some of the cars. And so I walked down to a very pleasant, nice BMW keyed on both sides, and there was another car from one of our sales team at the front that have been keyed and I thought, what am I going to do? And I remember Bib. I rang him and I asked for Robert and he said, David, one day, people will accept it's a very big event and it will succeed. And your radio station has put its name to it and you've put your name to it because I was doing ads again, and the other thing is, David, it's a car. And I thought he'd be saying, here we go. And that was Bib’s reaction. And guess what? He's right. Look at the Grand Prix now.
Michael Stillwell
It's an amazing event and world leading in terms of attendance.
Tony McManus
We'll do this break. When we come back, more of your calls. By the way, lots of texts coming in. People in South Australia are saying you're still Ford in Adelaide. Any relation?
Michael Stillwell
Yeah, absolutely. We can talk about that after.
Tony McManus
Yeah we'll do that when we come back. It is Australia overnight. Good morning to everyone.
Special guest in the studio, Family Business Association is Michael Stillwell, David G Mann, known to many listeners of 5AA in Adelaide. Good morning to you as well. And our very special guest, as I said, is Michael Stillwell, part of the family business so proudly known right around Australia because we're talking about businesses in Melbourne, we're talking about certainly in South Australia. For how long in SA?
Michael Stillwell
1971, 72.
Tony McManus
Was the first ones?
Michael Stillwell
So, we were a Ford dealership here in Melbourne. Dad took on Ford in 1966, took the Holden shingle down, put the Ford shingle up, which was a big shock to everyone except for us.
Tony McManus
Do you remember that decision being made? Was there angst around that at the time?
Michael Stillwell
So we had the EH Holden, which was a wonderful car, and they introduced the HD. And the HD, for those that remember, had kidney scoops around the headlights. It was sale proof. We struggled. And Ford was really wanting to grow the network, took that out to Broadmeadows, showed him the new Falcon that was coming, the XR, showed him the escort, the Cortina, and the Fairlane. And I think the thing that swung the deal was they offered parts distribution. So, on the 14th of February 1966, which was the day of decimal currency, the holden shingle came down.
David Mann
I collect memorabilia and I still have the complete minted set.
Tony McManus
I'll bet you do. Go on, Michael.
Michael Stillwell
So, you'll recall that business wasn't too flashed in the early 70s, it was a pretty tough time and there was a Ford dealer, David Ford in Adelaide, they’re in Franklin Street and 1 Main North Road, Medindie and they were in trouble. And Ford approached Dad and said, look, would you take it on, which we did. And Graeme Bignell, who was Dad's business partner here in Melbourne, went across to run it and very successfully built a very large automotive group there in South Australia.
Tony McManus
We'll talk about customer service and some of the great teams and staff around all these businesses part of Family Business Association, which is so important to the culture of Australia. Judy in Mount Eliza. Good morning, Judy. Say hello to Michael Stillwell and David Mann.
Caller - Judy
Hello, Michael and David. I've got a little bit of laryngitis at the moment. I'm going right back. I'm now 75 and my brother is John and he used to own you, allowing him a lot, right? So he got where I'm coming from.
Michael Stillwell
Yes, I know you. I know who you're talking about. Yes.
Caller - Judy
OK, well, he went back a long way. You remember the pilot strike many years ago? And I think your father.
Michael Stillwell
I think it was referred to as the pilot dispute. But yes, I do recall it.
Caller - Judy
And my brother desperately needed to get to New Zealand and I think Bib offered him his private plane to fly over to you there. I think he did because they weren't in competition necessarily, they were acquaintances and friends, I mean, great respect, and John was, the longest Land Rover dealer in the world, 49 years, and that is on a record as a dealer principal. He is now retired of course, happily doing what he does, still working, but still doing well and overseas and here and everything. But the other one was Bob Jane. I knew Bob Jane. I didn't know Bob Jane, I didn't particularly like him but we all know what Bob was like. But do you remember? Peter Evans and John Sawyer.
Michael Stillwell
Yes, certainly John Sawyer. Well, John and David of course, John was instrumental in the restoration of the Poly good side.
Caller - Judy
I was living in Sydney then, and it was Oran Park was it? When they raced up there, a McLaren and a Mustang and.
Michael Stillwell
Yeah, McLaren sports car with the Repco V8 in it, yes.
Caller - Judy
Yeah, they brought them up in the big Pantech to race at Oran Park. And I knew both the boys who were driving that truck, that was Peter and John, and they came round in there with a few drinks and things like that as you do friends and cars and whatever. And I joined in and helped them wash down the Pantech to arrive looking nice and pretty and they let me drive through the gates of Oran Park.
Tony McManus
Judy, what a great story and some fantastic memories there. It's those memories that it resonates so beautifully with so many people around Australia.
Michael Stillwell
Yeah, I mentioned Tony, I got on the ferry the other day from Sorrento. So, I pulled up and I'm chatting to the lady at the counter, and she was giving me a frequent ferry user card, said, name. I said Michael, surname Stillwell. She gone all, Bib Stillwell? I said, that was my dad. She's gone, my family bought a Holden from your father and I said, that's gotta be back in the 1960s. And it's amazing that people that you bump into.
Tony McManus
The memory, yeah. It's fantastic. I want to talk to you about the culture of teams and people out in the workshops, the sales team and the idea of service, it's been bandied around for some years as you know. How important was that part of the business?
Michael Stillwell
So I think the best way to share it is growing up around the dinner table at home and typically, the phone would ring, and it would be a customer that might have had an issue with the service department or the sales department. Dad would listen patiently, would make a note of the issues raised by the customer. Next morning, Barbara Pearson, his personal assistant, fix it. And Barbara would. But Dad always had a very caring and thorough approach to customers. And growing up in the business in the 1970s, as we all did, you saw the difference that that made to our customer relationships and not just your customers, but your staff as well. Dad was very caring. I told the story just a few minutes ago about people coming back to Bib Stillwell, back home.
Tony McManus
Staff members coming back returning to the business.
David Mann
One of our great sponsors with breakfast, with Ross and Russ, Craig from Mercedes Benz Berwick. I first met Craig when he was working at Stillwell BMW and he was fantastic. And I think he learned a lot from Bib and from Michael and Robert and all the team there and now obviously you know heading up the dealership out there.
Tony McManus
Amazing dealership out there and very important, those people that learned their trade and probably a lot of people in the garages as well, presumably, workshops.
Michael Stillwell
But you talk about Craig Howard. Now, that's another amazing family business because that's the battalions that own the Mercedes Benz and the Patterson Cheney Group, which that's part of, and another significant family business. And to pick on what you were saying earlier, David, very generous philanthropist as well. But it's culture, it's your approach to the way you manage people, customer relationships and your engagement with the community.
David Mann
It's something that Michael would not know and either would Robert. And Robert and Michael were my contacts, along with Chris and Nick, to a degree. But when the cars need to be serviced, Bib would ring me and say, look, I think it's about time we brought the car in, because they were demonstrated models and he said, but we we'll put it under another name and people, they hear you on radio but they don't know what you look like and he would ask me to be a mystery shopper.
Tony McManus
Which has always worked well for us, David.
David Mann
Good head for radio. Thank you, Tony. And I would go there, take the car and then sit back, have a listen, talk to the people, almost set them up, which was probably not the right thing to do but then we would have a debrief about it and what Michael said was right. Bib worked because Bib could have been sitting back, playing golf and having a lovely life but he worked on the business until, and this upsets me, until the very day that he passed away in the showroom checking the renovations of this magnificent showroom in South Yarra there, and he passed away.
Michael Stillwell
David, it’s now, this June, 25 years ago.
David Mann
But he worked on and in the business and he loved his children. He loved his children. There were the things that he said just always look after family.
Michael Stillwell
But it's interesting you talk about that because one of the things we did, we did this two or three times, we took our entire customer facing staff, we booked them in for a night at a City Hotel, luxury hotel, chauffeur driven in and then get the full concierge treatment at the hotel with the check in, showing to the room and then a facilitated dinner. And the point of the exercise was, Dad's perspective was, you need to understand that this is what your customers are used to. This is the level of service they get at the Hilton or the Hyatt or the other high-end hotels. This is the level of service that we need to offer at our dealership. Lived it, eat it, ate it, breathed it.
Tony McManus
Because in the day, my recollection as a kid in dealerships was there would be often grease and crap all over the showroom floors. But in the smaller ones, it was always. They now sparkle. Sometimes, they are a palace. BMW will be the leader in that.
Michael Stillwell
You talk about motorsport? That was where motorsport was so important because the professional teams we spoke about, that call before we spoke about Bob Jane, the cars were spotless, the workshops were spotless, the trucks were spotless. A standard was set. And that's why we ran the business.
David Mann
Bib made networks work not for him, but Royal District Nursing Service I mentioned before, he was running the board there and the honourable Geoff Kennard was the premier of the day and Bib said, will you set a function up at Parliament House. And I said yes, no problems and he said the premier will be speaking and we're trying to raise some funds for Royal District Nursing Service and we needed funds for some research and to help.
Michael Stillwell
Radios, I will recall.
David Mann
That was one of the things and so, the premier turned up, he made his speech and then I introduced Mr Stillwell and he spoke about Royal District Nursing Service. And I was back up there and the premier said, excuse me, Mr Mann, I need to interrupt. And I looked at Bib and Bib looked at me and all the people assembled there. The premier got up and he said, Bib hasn't got me here just to be nice. Ladies and gentlemen, he said, I'm pleased to make an announcement today that we will be giving Royal District Nursing Service $1 million, so Bib made things work for the network. He wasn't focused on himself.
Tony McManus
Great story. It's all part of Family Business Association. If you have just joined us, we're talking about great family businesses, one of which is the brand Stillwell. One of the things they do at FBA and I guess as a family business, part of the family, Michael, is the idea of governance, how important that is and really succession planning, how important that becomes, notwithstanding how big or small those family businesses are.
Michael Stillwell
Well for us, it's been an interesting journey. We were reflecting a little earlier that Dad passed away some 25 years ago. Dad had a very simple approach to governance. He had a directors’ meeting daily in front of the shaving mirror with himself. And I think one of the first things we realised after he sadly passed away that that approach wasn't going to last for too long.
Tony McManus
Had it not been spoken about prior to that sadly?
Michael Stillwell
With the help of an external auditor that Dad trusted, we put together a potential succession plan and dad had written what we called a memorandum of wishes which just outlined how he liked to see things in the event of his demise. Now, a lot of this was driven by the fact he had a fairly significant race car accident 2 years before he passed away and that really knocked the stuffing out of him, and it was the beginning at the end, I think at that point. So after his passing, we put a board together, the five of us, Gillian, my stepmother was initially the chair, then we brought in an external chair and then over time, we added external directors to it. But keep in mind this was 25 years ago. Now, I'm the oldest of five, I'm now in my sort of early 70s. My brother, Robert, likewise. We recognise that at some point we'd need to transition from our generation to the 14 in the next generation. So we started a programme. My sister Marianne drove it, but probably 15 years ago, started a Next Gen Council, so got them used to coming together, and meeting, and we gave them some money to manage as an investment pool, to give them something to focus on. They've now done company directors’ courses. My nephew has done a couple of Harvard courses during COVID. They're well prepared. So, we're now willing to execute the succession plan of us stepping off.
Tony McManus
But it doesn't just happen.
Michael Stillwell
Planned, managed, organised and we have a family office. My brother Chris ran it for a while. My sister Marianne ran it for a while. I ran it for a while. My niece Aubrey, Aubrey is Robert’s daughter.
Tony McManus
We're gonna run out of time, and I knew we would. The aviation division became synonymous, particularly in Melbourne. How important was that to the business and certainly to Bib himself?
Michael Stillwell
The great thing about Dad was he'd learnt to fly, but sort of ran foul on my grandfather, but then went back to flying in the early 1960s, realised that the flying school he was learning at was going broke and bought the business. Good entrepreneurial gentleman, ran it like a car dealership very successfully. So, we were a Beechcraft agent at the time. So he stepped his way through the different beech aircraft up to the King Air, which was a pressurised twin turboprop aeroplane. So, the next step was the learjet, so, went to the US, bought an air jet, brought it back to Australia, negotiated the agency for the Asia Pacific. We sold a lot of Learjets and this is really the birth of commercial aviation or corporate aviation in the late 1970s, early 1980s. People will remember heading out to Tullamarine on Essendon Airport, there was a corner showroom Stillwell Learjet, with the Learjet in the lit window at night. It was fabulous. We also distributed the metro liner which was really the aeroplane that transformed that second tier industry. And then as a result of that, Dad was offered the opportunity to go to the US for 10 years as the Executive Vice President of Lear.
Tony McManus
Well, what a great story. And I thank you for coming in. We have raging conversations on the overnight programme about electric vehicles. Are you enthused or still somewhat hesitant about what the next generation might look like?
Michael Stillwell
I'm open minded. We currently have BMW Mini and Volvo in our brands. They do gasoline powered cars, diesel powered cars and electric vehicles. Electric is challenging for a whole variety of reasons. Yeah, and it's interesting, the US market is turning against it, which I find interesting, but the Europeans are still working hard to make it.
Tony McManus
Thank you Michael Stillwell, lovely to see you and thank you for coming in.
Michael Stillwell
It's been a delight and David, just great to catch up with you as well.
Tony McManus
And anybody in family business, you should join Family Business Association.
